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Re: Foles?

September 02, 2018 01:01AM
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zn
Quote
moklerman
I was going to suggest a guy like Ferguson as a solid but not spectacular QB who the Rams would have won more with during the '70's, not knowing that he was actually available for them to draft. Fouts wouldn't have been Fouts with the Rams and maybe Jaworski suffered from the '70's equivalent of Jeff Fisher ball considering how poorly he was supported and how hamstrung a QB probably was with the Rams run first philosophy?

Jaworksi started 3 games for the Rams.

His best year as a pro was with the Eagles in 1980, when he was 2nd in the league in qb rating and 6th in TDs. I mention this because the 1980 Eagles ran more than they passed (they passed 46% of the time). So no, a run first philosophy never hampered him.

Coincidentally, Joe Ferguson's best year as a pro (playing a full season) was 1981,. He was just 14th in the league in qb rating but 6th in TDs. That year Buffalo ran just over 50% of the time. So it didn't hamper him either.

And for the record I am not a "run first on offense" kind of guy. I am a "run whatever offense suits your personnel and which you can execute as a strength" kind of guy. I don't dismiss either run-first or pass-first offense or balanced offenses for that matter. I think if you have the players and can execute you can win with any offensive approach. Last year for example the Rams were 9th in rushing attempts and 24th in passing attempts. They passed 54% of the time, which in this era means they were more of a balanced offense than a pass-first offense. Pittsburgh for example threw 58% of the time which makes them more passing first. Similarly the Patz threw 59% of the time. A run heavy team like Jax threw 51% of the time. Their best year on offense, 2012 (the only year not coincidentally they played a starting caliber veteran qb all 16 games), the Fisher Rams threw 59% of the time.
I appreciate you digging up stats but I think one has to be careful about year-end ratios. They don't necessarily suggest whether a team is run-first or pass first. Situations dictate what you have to do but that doesn't necessarily coincide with what you are and what you're trying to do. While a 50%+ ratio may suggest a team is more pass than run, I think those numbers can easily be misleading.

But, that's just verbal shorthand anyway. Run-first, run-heavy, run-mentality...whatever one wants to call it, I think it's safe to say that the '70's Rams were more about the run than the pass and their QB's were often asked to throw in predictable pass situations which put them behind the 8-ball.

Which was basically how most teams did things at that time so it wasn't just a Rams thing. But the carousel at QB didn't help those Rams teams overall IMO. Having a steady, solid guy in there every week I think would have and is why I suggested Ferguson as a random example of a guy who was in the lineup every week for most of his career and was capable enough. Why they never gave Jaworski much of a chance is puzzling to me. As you say, he showed he could be competent, if not productive, even with a run-heavy team.

Going after "maypop" QB's(far beyond retreads in many cases) seemed to be what they liked to do. Hadl, Namath, Jones, Bartkowski, etc. That goes into the '80's but the pattern with the Rams is there. They drafted plenty of capable guys but always seemed to prefer the worn out vet when it actually came to starting. They drafted Jaworski but went with FA acquisitions Namath and Harris instead. Drafted Ferragamo but were usually looking for someone "better". Haden, Jones, Bartkowski. Ultimately, getting rid of Gabriel haunted the team for a while. While Hadl had the one great year he hit the wall and the Rams were left pretty directionless at QB for a long time.

It's part of what makes a QB so valuable in the NFL. Without one to hang your hat on, most franchises don't regularly sustain success. For whatever reason, that leader is needed to, well..."lead" the way. I guess because a team needs a defined identity and direction to wrap everything together. Many have tried to just plug and play the QB position but it rarely works or sustains success.
SubjectAuthorViewsPosted

  Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated

reggae729September 01, 2018 06:51PM

  Re: Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated NO

BumRap225September 01, 2018 08:14PM

  Foles?

RamBill464September 01, 2018 08:26PM

  Re: Foles?

reggae216September 01, 2018 08:50PM

  Re: Foles?

moklerman251September 01, 2018 11:39PM

  Re: Foles?

zn193September 02, 2018 12:17AM

  Re: Foles?

moklerman155September 02, 2018 01:01AM

  Re: Foles?

zn152September 02, 2018 09:03PM

  Re: Foles?

zn244September 01, 2018 08:54PM

  LOL...great post!!!!

SunTzu_vs_Camus212September 02, 2018 12:34AM

  Most of Foles problems was Fisher

Rams_8184September 09, 2018 05:41AM

  not the least bit true I'm afraid

zn78September 09, 2018 05:52AM

  Re: Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated

David Deacon160September 02, 2018 02:32AM

  I think you all under value Cousins...

jemach239September 02, 2018 04:56AM

  You nailed it

NewMexicoRam100February 01, 2019 12:19PM

  In the NFL 10+ years ago Yes. In the NFL today...NO

chunkmeister143September 02, 2018 03:45AM

  To say this is an unabashed passing league is a bit overstated IMO...

jemach168September 02, 2018 06:14AM

  Re: To say this is an unabashed passing league is a bit overstated IMO...

zn153September 02, 2018 09:08AM

  I view the reasons for the stats differently

chunkmeister227September 02, 2018 09:32AM

  Re: I view the reasons for the stats differently

zn141September 02, 2018 10:18AM

  I'm going to go out on a limb...

jemach195September 02, 2018 04:54AM

  Re: I'm going to go out on a limb...

Rampage2K-168September 02, 2018 08:45AM

  I can't even go there...

jemach113September 02, 2018 01:43PM

  Re: I can't even go there...

Rampage2K-89September 02, 2018 01:45PM

  Hey...when Goff carries this team...

jemach78September 02, 2018 01:51PM

  Re: Hey...when Goff carries this team...

Rampage2K-89September 02, 2018 01:55PM

  The problem is.....

NewMexicoRam86September 02, 2018 02:35PM

  No one is saying Goff can't do the job...

jemach84September 03, 2018 01:53AM

  Re: No one is saying Goff can't do the job...

Rampage2K-88September 03, 2018 10:13AM

  Careful with that rationale

moklerman82September 03, 2018 11:25AM

  Re: Careful with that rationale

Rampage2K-86September 03, 2018 11:55AM

  Re: Careful with that rationale

moklerman77September 03, 2018 02:28PM

  Re: Careful with that rationale

Rampage2K-83September 03, 2018 02:36PM

  Re: Careful with that rationale

moklerman196September 03, 2018 05:07PM

  Goff will never be as old as Rodgers

reggae94September 03, 2018 05:50PM

  I don't know....

JamesJM86September 04, 2018 04:58AM

  Re: Alright James

RamsFanSinceLA71September 05, 2018 07:58AM

  I think your wrong James

waterfield78September 05, 2018 11:35AM

  Goff was born after Rogers

waterfield68September 05, 2018 11:19AM

  Only 7 "so-so" QB's have won Super Bowls

NewMexicoRam160September 02, 2018 06:33AM

  Name the 7...

jemach174September 02, 2018 06:42AM

  Re: Name the 7...

NewMexicoRam511September 02, 2018 12:28PM

  I have an argument for 11...

jemach162September 02, 2018 01:48PM

  Last 15 years, only 2 SB winning QBs have no shot at HOF

max189September 03, 2018 12:23PM

  Re: Name the 7...

stlramz129September 02, 2018 09:18PM

  No

NewMexicoRam101September 03, 2018 09:30AM

  I now want to see the Rams play the Pats in the SB...

RAMbler141September 05, 2018 08:24AM

  put Brady with Fisher and he becomes a so so quarterback

Rams_81149September 03, 2018 08:18AM

  Re: put Brady with Fisher and he becomes a so so quarterback

Steve90September 06, 2018 05:19AM

  You are right so so was too strong

Rams_8172September 09, 2018 05:35AM

  Re: Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated

SoCalRAMatic121September 05, 2018 10:58AM

  You mean Bill Belicheck

Rams_8179September 09, 2018 05:38AM

  I go it wrong Matt Cassell

Rams_8173September 10, 2018 01:17AM

  Re: Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated

Rampage2K-92February 01, 2019 10:16AM

  Re: Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated

cool_hand_luke75February 01, 2019 06:03PM

  Re: Is the value of a "Franchise" QB overstated

Rampage2K-72February 01, 2019 09:20PM