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PHDram
ok. hes not being "definitive". im not sure how he could be. hes trying to read into someones body language via 5 sec tv clips, nd then further infer how his teammates may feel about him. i understand hes offering his impressions which is an impression that fits his narrative and exactly what i said.

and IF were in agreement that qbs can improve after year five why offer the statement that goff has no upside. how does one reach that conclusion? you want to cite is "trajectory'? any qb that NEEDS to improve after 5 years isnt ascending. tannehil clearly wasnt ascending. he was cut. moreover, any qb that has the physical talent that goff has and has performed at the level goff has (even if inconsistent) has upside.

Tannehill was injured for crying out loud. He missed all of 2017 and when he came back in '18, he got off to a pretty good start and then got hurt again. The Dolphins were in rebuild mode and let him go. He wasn't just cut because he wasn't ascending.

And speaking of Goff in particular, I didn't say that he "can't" improve but I certainly feel like the evidence against that happening is mounting. We're not talking about a QB who is dealing with injuries, lost personnel, changing coaches/schemes or anything else like that. Goff has benefited from just about everything a QB would hope for. In the past 4 years he has been on a winning team with good coaching, a good scheme, good personnel and continuity. He's been in a situation that is presumably tailor made for his skill set, considering accuracy and decision making were two of his listed strengths coming out of college.

But I'm open to why you feel he's going to turn it around. Keep in mind though, I'm not going to be receptive to the argument that he can do it because of what he did 2+ years ago. That offense and that time are gone.