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Re: so in your own words

October 05, 2016 07:58AM
Quote
PHDram
shaw suggested that DV interview Martz...While suggesting an interview is apparently not encouragement in your world, it is mine. I often suggest things to my kids as a way of encouraging them to do it. But feel free to have your own opinion.

and quite frankly im not sure you or I really "know" how that developed internally. im willing to accept that DV was not "forced" to hire Martz although i recall hearing rumblings that shaw was going to fire him if he didnt. But i dont know that to be true. Nevertheless, thats not really the point now is it?

The point is that DV was accused of running an out of date offense and went and found a new OC. Moreover he too had an UNPROVEN OC and QB coach. its almost the exact same situation that fisher finds himself now.

You have the time frame wrong.

DV fired Rhome long before meeting with Shaw.

Later Shaw and DV met to discuss the team. Shaw recommended Martz. DV was free to turn down that recommendation. DV interviewed 2 guys and was free to choose between them.

Even John Shaw was smart enough to know you don't push a coordinator on a head coach. If you are going to hold a coach accountable for the results he has to have a say in who he works with.

And yes we do know a LOT about how how that developed because it was all openly spoken about, at the time, as it happened. And I mean spoken about by the major figures involved, including Shaw.

And no, DV was never accused of running an "out of date offense." The problem in 98 was that the offense was just dysfunctional in general. The term "out of date" never came up back then. The terms were more likely to be "Rhome suxx," "Banks suxx," "can Bruce come back."

Remember, this was 99...long before people in 2016 were running around with the mistaken idea that a strong play action offense featuring the run to complement a defense was "out of date" (when it's actually the approach of several 2015 play-off teams.)

Plus no one at the time knew what kind of coordinator Martz was going to be ANYWAY. Turner, remember, was the coordinator for the Aikman/Smith offense...that's what he was known for at the time...and Martz was just Turner's qb coach in Washington. So no one had any advance idea that Martz would be that good, let alone that he would change the way offense was played. The idea as to whether Martz was "up to" or "out of" date just never came up. That was then. Just like westerns set in the 19th century don't include scenes involving microwaves, in early 99 no one was talking about Martz's "up to or out of" datedness.

...



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2016 08:01AM by zn.
SubjectAuthorViewsPosted

  Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

Rams432205October 03, 2016 05:48PM

  Wow, pretty much confirms most of our concerns about QB coaching

promomasterj781October 04, 2016 01:13PM

  except that

PHDram874October 04, 2016 01:25PM

  Re: except that

~lyser748October 04, 2016 01:45PM

  Re: except that

govane449October 05, 2016 07:53AM

  Re: Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

waterfield558October 04, 2016 02:20PM

  And what does that say to you? NM

PHDram528October 04, 2016 02:39PM

  Re: Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

Speed_Kills522October 04, 2016 04:10PM

  good read speed!

Speed_Kills355February 22, 2017 07:22AM

  A lot of unproven assertions there by Coach Vermeil.

Saguaro616October 04, 2016 02:50PM

  Re: nice

leafnose345February 22, 2017 10:59AM

  I agree with DV on one thing, Goff has to run over them with a bus.

max669October 04, 2016 03:07PM

  Nope he has to prove he can "speak the language"

LesBaker578October 04, 2016 03:25PM

  Vermeil doesn't buy that, neither do I.

max515October 04, 2016 03:38PM

  Max.

Saguaro515October 04, 2016 04:08PM

  Re: Max.

max527October 04, 2016 05:06PM

  Re: I have no problem with this nm

Speed_Kills520October 04, 2016 05:07PM

  And yet

PHDram432October 04, 2016 06:38PM

  Re: Max.

no name437October 05, 2016 04:15AM

  Re: It can be argued

Speed_Kills469October 04, 2016 04:24PM

  Funny

PHDram447October 04, 2016 04:50PM

  Re: Funny

Rampage2K-507October 04, 2016 05:12PM

  Spagsvanie

RFIP467October 05, 2016 02:16AM

  Makes perfect sense and should be a red flag...

max556October 05, 2016 02:31AM

  Except they said that ain't gonna happen

LesBaker752October 04, 2016 05:04PM

  Having a good QB environment is not a shortcut.

max764October 05, 2016 02:04AM

  No it's different each time

LesBaker615October 05, 2016 02:33AM

  So now we've got Bill Walsh level coaching? Come on...

max430October 05, 2016 03:35AM

  You are willfully ignoring the point and the facts

LesBaker453October 05, 2016 03:38AM

  Last time...

max419October 05, 2016 03:49AM

  You mean the same vermeil

PHDram588October 05, 2016 04:18AM

  history...DV was not forced to hire Martz

zn509October 05, 2016 04:44AM

  Shaw recommended interviewing Martz

wv ram545October 05, 2016 05:04AM

  Re: Shaw recommended interviewing Martz

zn1042October 05, 2016 05:11AM

  but wait theres more

PHDram589October 05, 2016 05:53AM

  Re: but wait theres more

zn822October 05, 2016 06:20AM

  so in your own words

PHDram542October 05, 2016 06:39AM

  Re: so in your own words

zn544October 05, 2016 07:58AM

  Ike/Torry/Faulk/Az/Kurt vs Britt/Quick/Gurley/Case

wv ram473October 05, 2016 10:29AM

  Being Dead Last and expectations

Rams_81393October 06, 2016 10:35PM

  Re: You mean the same vermeil

max465October 05, 2016 06:27AM

  maybe youre right

PHDram357October 05, 2016 06:43AM

  Re: maybe youre right

max499October 05, 2016 06:49AM

  True

PHDram575October 05, 2016 07:29AM

  Re: True

max398October 05, 2016 07:55AM

  Ok, dare I say it?

Saguaro693October 05, 2016 08:54AM

  Maybe he has an issue with Fisher

LesBaker360October 05, 2016 01:41PM

  You believed Fisher when he drafted Goff

9er8er381February 21, 2017 06:32PM

  14 TDs 4 INTS. 90 + passer rating

JoeMad598October 04, 2016 09:20PM

  Re: 14 TDs 4 INTS. 90 + passer rating

six2stack468October 05, 2016 04:01AM

  Gotta love hind sight.

Ramgator478October 05, 2016 02:42AM

  gotta get some of those glasses

PHDram493October 05, 2016 06:05AM

  Yep! (nm)

Suh-weet!566October 05, 2016 07:03AM

  Here's a thought...

Rams43574October 05, 2016 07:15AM

  isnt that a bit premature?

PHDram523October 05, 2016 07:34AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rams43432October 05, 2016 07:58AM

  the problem is

zn571October 05, 2016 08:08AM

  Re: the problem is

Rams43470October 05, 2016 09:25AM

  Re: the problem is

waterfield376October 07, 2016 07:12AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

PHDram470October 05, 2016 08:20AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rams43404October 05, 2016 09:30AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

dzrams417October 05, 2016 10:44AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rams43977October 05, 2016 11:08AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rampage2K-401October 05, 2016 11:22AM

  absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

zn443October 05, 2016 11:39AM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

Rampage2K-378October 05, 2016 11:45AM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

zn425October 05, 2016 11:54AM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

Rampage2K-436October 05, 2016 12:02PM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

zn423October 05, 2016 12:07PM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

moklerman478October 05, 2016 09:32PM

  Wow, so much dogging on Vermeil and contortions to explain away his quotes

promomasterj427October 05, 2016 04:13PM

  So.

Saguaro663October 05, 2016 05:22PM

  an opinion from afar

LesBaker670October 05, 2016 05:31PM

  "he's on a farm! ??? (my favorite)". Yes, promo, a farm.

Saguaro1075October 06, 2016 05:42AM

  One of the greatest living coaches of the game

promomasterj565October 06, 2016 11:04AM

  It's not that it his opinion is "disqualified"...

Saguaro480October 06, 2016 12:19PM

  You're assuming he doesn't still talk to people in the league

promomasterj386October 06, 2016 01:33PM

  You don't know what I'm assuming.

Saguaro512October 06, 2016 02:17PM

  Fisher and Rams will get credit for developing any qb when they do it

promomasterj373October 06, 2016 04:32PM

  Now there I agree. Fisher still needs to prove it.

Saguaro478October 06, 2016 05:18PM

  Ha! Farmer puns not just for Farmers only....dot com.

promomasterj400October 07, 2016 09:48AM

  I made the mistake once....

JamesJM383October 07, 2016 09:55AM

  You should read the whole article

PHDram400October 06, 2016 04:21PM

  Boy, did Vermeil nail this one....

max478February 21, 2017 12:28PM

  Re: Did he? We won't know that for awhile yet...NM

laram596February 21, 2017 12:50PM

  We already know he was right about Fisher..NM

max492February 21, 2017 02:43PM

  He did not nail it on Wentz

LesBaker351February 21, 2017 04:56PM

  Tremendous Vermeil Article

Rams_81513February 21, 2017 05:22PM

  A goal seeking nailing

9er8er432February 21, 2017 06:53PM

  Experience is magnified though when unprepared

Rams_81347February 22, 2017 07:08AM