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Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

October 03, 2016 05:48PM
[www.philly.com]

by Mike Sielski, Inquirer Columnist

On the 114-acre piece of Chester County land that has been his home since 1987, a place that can feel as far away from football as a man can get, Dick Vermeil still found over the last three weeks that he just couldn't help himself, that he had to dive into the data to better understand the excellence of Carson Wentz.


The kid couldn't be this good this fast, so Vermeil started digging through record books and statistics to compare Wentz's first three games with the Eagles to the debuts of the NFL's greatest quarterbacks. Joe Montana? No. Troy Aikman. Hell no, not with that 1-15 Cowboys team. Dan Marino? No, not even him. None of them had played this well this early, and perhaps the closest comparison to Wentz was one from Vermeil's own experience: Kurt Warner and the 1999 St. Louis Rams.

"Where Wentz and Kurt Warner are alike is their personality profile, their temperaments," Vermeil, who turns 80 on Oct. 30, said in a phone interview Friday. "Nothing at all, at any time, flustered Kurt Warner. From the very first step he took on the field in the league opener in 1999, [offensive coordinator] Mike Martz coached him as if Kurt had been playing in the league for 10 years."


You keep hearing the same compliment paid to Wentz, and for Vermeil, still a sentimental hero here for coaching the Eagles to their first Super Bowl, it's just one of several similarities between this year's Eagles and the '99 Rams that are too obvious to miss. Just like these Eagles, those Rams were coming off a losing season - they'd gone 4-12 in 1998 - and lost their starting quarterback during the preseason, only the reason for that change was far more traumatic than the Eagles' decision to trade Sam Bradford to the Vikings for a first-round draft pick.

When Trent Green went down with a season-ending knee injury, Vermeil said, the Rams fell into "immediate depression." And it was only when Warner - with that humble background as a grocery-bagger and an Arena Football League quarterback, with all of 11 pass attempts in his NFL career - revealed himself to be football's answer to Roy Hobbs that the Rams realized how good they still were and might yet be.

"No way I could believe he could end up being what he was," Vermeil said. "We didn't know he could play at the level to be the most valuable player of the league. With Carson Wentz, when the team got rid of Sam Bradford, it wasn't emotional depression. They got rid of a kid they knew could play, and they had a guy there more ready to play than anyone thought.


"He appears to have those attributes: poise, confidence, toughness. There are certain people who, when they get in a game, it slows down for them, and there are certain people who, when they get in a game, the game gets faster. Carson Wentz, the game slows down for him."

For all the praise that Wentz deserves, Vermeil was quick to credit the Eagles' quarterback politburo - coach Doug Pederson, offensive coordinator Frank Reich, and quarterbacks coach John DeFilippo - for creating an environment in which Wentz could thrive. It was an approach that Vermeil himself was successful in implementing throughout his coaching career. Ron Jaworski with the Eagles, Warner with the Rams, Green with the Kansas City Chiefs: These quarterbacks had their best, most productive seasons under Vermeil, and he believes at his core that, when it comes to identifying and developing great quarterbacks, the secret is simple: Either you got it, or you don't.

In that way, he looks at the Eagles and sees everything his '99 Rams team did right - and everything the Rams' more recent teams have done wrong. There was Bradford, whom the Rams drafted with the No. 1 pick in 2010, whose five years in St. Louis saw him tear his left ACL twice and deal with constant change on the offensive coaching staff. There was Nick Foles, who lasted one awful season before the Rams released him and Andy Reid and the Chiefs signed him to be a backup. Now there is Jared Goff - the No. 1 pick in this year's draft, the only player picked ahead of Wentz - who can't get off the bench in Los Angeles, who in Vermeil's mind is more likely to be a bust just by being with the Rams than he would have been with the Eagles.

"No question," he said. "First off, unfortunately for the Rams, how many offensive coordinators have they fired and quarterbacks have they gone through? Sam Bradford is going to prove he can really play. He can take a team to the Super Bowl. But within that environment, the supporting cast was never good enough to show that he was worthy of that first pick. . . . There are organizations where a quarterback would have to run over them with a bus for them to recognize he can play."

Dick Vermeil's voice was rising over the phone now as he made that assertion. In fact, we had already said goodbye, but he had called back because he was so set on making that point: that circumstances and coaching matter, that a promising young quarterback in a bad situation has little or no shot to succeed. But by the time we hung up a second time, the old coach was at least confident in this thought: The first NFL team he was in charge of doesn't have that problem now.
SubjectAuthorViewsPosted

  Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

Rams432203October 03, 2016 05:48PM

  Wow, pretty much confirms most of our concerns about QB coaching

promomasterj780October 04, 2016 01:13PM

  except that

PHDram872October 04, 2016 01:25PM

  Re: except that

~lyser748October 04, 2016 01:45PM

  Re: except that

govane447October 05, 2016 07:53AM

  Re: Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

waterfield558October 04, 2016 02:20PM

  And what does that say to you? NM

PHDram527October 04, 2016 02:39PM

  Re: Vermeil on Goff, Wentz, Bradford, and QB development...

Speed_Kills520October 04, 2016 04:10PM

  good read speed!

Speed_Kills354February 22, 2017 07:22AM

  A lot of unproven assertions there by Coach Vermeil.

Saguaro615October 04, 2016 02:50PM

  Re: nice

leafnose343February 22, 2017 10:59AM

  I agree with DV on one thing, Goff has to run over them with a bus.

max669October 04, 2016 03:07PM

  Nope he has to prove he can "speak the language"

LesBaker577October 04, 2016 03:25PM

  Vermeil doesn't buy that, neither do I.

max514October 04, 2016 03:38PM

  Max.

Saguaro513October 04, 2016 04:08PM

  Re: Max.

max527October 04, 2016 05:06PM

  Re: I have no problem with this nm

Speed_Kills519October 04, 2016 05:07PM

  And yet

PHDram431October 04, 2016 06:38PM

  Re: Max.

no name436October 05, 2016 04:15AM

  Re: It can be argued

Speed_Kills468October 04, 2016 04:24PM

  Funny

PHDram446October 04, 2016 04:50PM

  Re: Funny

Rampage2K-507October 04, 2016 05:12PM

  Spagsvanie

RFIP465October 05, 2016 02:16AM

  Makes perfect sense and should be a red flag...

max555October 05, 2016 02:31AM

  Except they said that ain't gonna happen

LesBaker751October 04, 2016 05:04PM

  Having a good QB environment is not a shortcut.

max764October 05, 2016 02:04AM

  No it's different each time

LesBaker614October 05, 2016 02:33AM

  So now we've got Bill Walsh level coaching? Come on...

max429October 05, 2016 03:35AM

  You are willfully ignoring the point and the facts

LesBaker452October 05, 2016 03:38AM

  Last time...

max419October 05, 2016 03:49AM

  You mean the same vermeil

PHDram587October 05, 2016 04:18AM

  history...DV was not forced to hire Martz

zn508October 05, 2016 04:44AM

  Shaw recommended interviewing Martz

wv ram544October 05, 2016 05:04AM

  Re: Shaw recommended interviewing Martz

zn1041October 05, 2016 05:11AM

  but wait theres more

PHDram588October 05, 2016 05:53AM

  Re: but wait theres more

zn821October 05, 2016 06:20AM

  so in your own words

PHDram541October 05, 2016 06:39AM

  Re: so in your own words

zn544October 05, 2016 07:58AM

  Ike/Torry/Faulk/Az/Kurt vs Britt/Quick/Gurley/Case

wv ram472October 05, 2016 10:29AM

  Being Dead Last and expectations

Rams_81392October 06, 2016 10:35PM

  Re: You mean the same vermeil

max464October 05, 2016 06:27AM

  maybe youre right

PHDram356October 05, 2016 06:43AM

  Re: maybe youre right

max498October 05, 2016 06:49AM

  True

PHDram573October 05, 2016 07:29AM

  Re: True

max397October 05, 2016 07:55AM

  Ok, dare I say it?

Saguaro693October 05, 2016 08:54AM

  Maybe he has an issue with Fisher

LesBaker359October 05, 2016 01:41PM

  You believed Fisher when he drafted Goff

9er8er380February 21, 2017 06:32PM

  14 TDs 4 INTS. 90 + passer rating

JoeMad596October 04, 2016 09:20PM

  Re: 14 TDs 4 INTS. 90 + passer rating

six2stack468October 05, 2016 04:01AM

  Gotta love hind sight.

Ramgator477October 05, 2016 02:42AM

  gotta get some of those glasses

PHDram491October 05, 2016 06:05AM

  Yep! (nm)

Suh-weet!565October 05, 2016 07:03AM

  Here's a thought...

Rams43573October 05, 2016 07:15AM

  isnt that a bit premature?

PHDram521October 05, 2016 07:34AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rams43431October 05, 2016 07:58AM

  the problem is

zn570October 05, 2016 08:08AM

  Re: the problem is

Rams43469October 05, 2016 09:25AM

  Re: the problem is

waterfield376October 07, 2016 07:12AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

PHDram470October 05, 2016 08:20AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rams43403October 05, 2016 09:30AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

dzrams417October 05, 2016 10:44AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rams43976October 05, 2016 11:08AM

  Re: isnt that a bit premature?

Rampage2K-400October 05, 2016 11:22AM

  absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

zn442October 05, 2016 11:39AM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

Rampage2K-377October 05, 2016 11:45AM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

zn424October 05, 2016 11:54AM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

Rampage2K-435October 05, 2016 12:02PM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

zn421October 05, 2016 12:07PM

  Re: absolutely not what he said 43...it's not even coachspeak, he flat did not say that

moklerman477October 05, 2016 09:32PM

  Wow, so much dogging on Vermeil and contortions to explain away his quotes

promomasterj427October 05, 2016 04:13PM

  So.

Saguaro662October 05, 2016 05:22PM

  an opinion from afar

LesBaker669October 05, 2016 05:31PM

  "he's on a farm! ??? (my favorite)". Yes, promo, a farm.

Saguaro1073October 06, 2016 05:42AM

  One of the greatest living coaches of the game

promomasterj564October 06, 2016 11:04AM

  It's not that it his opinion is "disqualified"...

Saguaro479October 06, 2016 12:19PM

  You're assuming he doesn't still talk to people in the league

promomasterj385October 06, 2016 01:33PM

  You don't know what I'm assuming.

Saguaro509October 06, 2016 02:17PM

  Fisher and Rams will get credit for developing any qb when they do it

promomasterj371October 06, 2016 04:32PM

  Now there I agree. Fisher still needs to prove it.

Saguaro477October 06, 2016 05:18PM

  Ha! Farmer puns not just for Farmers only....dot com.

promomasterj399October 07, 2016 09:48AM

  I made the mistake once....

JamesJM382October 07, 2016 09:55AM

  You should read the whole article

PHDram399October 06, 2016 04:21PM

  Boy, did Vermeil nail this one....

max477February 21, 2017 12:28PM

  Re: Did he? We won't know that for awhile yet...NM

laram595February 21, 2017 12:50PM

  We already know he was right about Fisher..NM

max491February 21, 2017 02:43PM

  He did not nail it on Wentz

LesBaker351February 21, 2017 04:56PM

  Tremendous Vermeil Article

Rams_81511February 21, 2017 05:22PM

  A goal seeking nailing

9er8er431February 21, 2017 06:53PM

  Experience is magnified though when unprepared

Rams_81346February 22, 2017 07:08AM