and you are certainly entitled to your opinion... I don't think Mike Vicks demise had anything to do with the inability to run any longer

sounds more to me like your rooting for Jackson to fail rather than what his actual upside is. He obviously is an extortionary talent and its not just his legs. His peers voted him the best player in football

yeah, we definitely disagree on Goff being elite... I'll just leave it there but end with this... right now far more people are just hoping he gets back to being middle of the pack and not in the bottom 3rd of the QB rankings

I never said there was a long list of QBs able to win without a run game and good coach you went there

I said Goff and Jimmy G each and very specifically are products of the play-action west coast offense they run under McVay and Shanahan. These offenses are very specifically (unlike the Coryell offense the Rams ran under Ernie Zampese, Dick Vermeil/Mike Martz offenses) reliant on play-action and their passing concepts are based on play-action and the deception of the run game. I also said that neither of them have shown themselves to be capable of beating good defenses when these things aren't working in their favor... they in fact often look very bad when they don't have the play-action pass working and in some cases have been forced to pass and play straight up

I'm not really sure how you could disagree with any of that.

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Ramsdude

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Speed_Kills
no some QBs handle pressure better and can beat good defenses even when they don't have a run game

IMO that is neither Gorapapollo nor Goff that are particularly reliant on it and especially in their offenses which are centered around the run and play action

I think your take is too harsh on Jackson. He is clearly a better passer than you give him credit for and for now his extraordinary ability to run the ball makes him one of the better QBs/players in football. It's part of his skillset.

I know people don't like change the game is clearly changing

Football is still football. IMO, Jackson is Mike Vick 2.0. When his legs go...so will his effectiveness. We have seen this with many other "great" running QB's. He isn't the first one. We have seen this movie before. lol

"Neither Goff or Gorrapolo are great without their head coaches and a really good run game"

I agree Goff and GarCRAPolo need a good run game and coach as do most QB's. A good OL is a must also. IMO, Goff is still Elite even with his weaknesses.

However, you failed to list these "GREAT" QB's who are "GREAT" without a run game or good coach. Please do. As I said, I am sure the list is a short one. IMO, you might not be giving Goff the credit he deserves.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/30/2020 03:51PM by Speed_Kills.